[Smokehouse]

Just A Thought:

What do you think Dealerships are paying Yamaha for the FZ-09? [Either across the board, or by State, or even by County or Country (and I’m thing of Canada, Australia, and Great Britain - with respect to other countries)]. It would be GREAT to be armed with that information when going to purchase the bike (or any bike or vehicle for that matter). Yes…And I realize this information may prove too difficult to even “guesstimate”. But I thought the question warranted consideration…..So I asked.

So – What do you think?

 

[deadduck357]

Well I think for this bike the MSRP is gonna have all the other manufacturers scratching their heads.

 

[Smokehouse]

Well I think for this bike the MSRP is gonna have all the other manufacturers scratching their heads.

Yeah…Seems to be the case. A “little birdie” told me that most Dealerships in the States would probably take delivery of the bike at 5% below regional MSRP. So that’s $7590.50. I have no idea how true that is, but it does seem possible.

 

[deadduck357]

Yeah…Seems to be the case. A “little birdie” told me that most Dealerships in the States would probably take delivery of the bike at 5% below regional MSRP. So that’s $7590.50. I have no idea how true that is, but it does seem possible.

Probably so, but I doubt it until the "new" on it runs out. It's too hot right now and from the sounds of it most dealers are asking MSRP and not budging much. It also depends on sales. If sales are good then it will be quite a wait to get a smokin' deal. If sales suck and they can't get them off the showroom then the prices will be more lenient. Also if you wait to long then the 2015 model are sure to be higher, when has MSRP ever dropped the next year.

 

[Smokehouse]

Probably so, but I doubt it until the "new" on it runs out. It's too hot right now and from the sounds of it most dealers are asking MSRP and not budging much. It also depends on sales. If sales are good then it will be quite a wait to get a smokin' deal. If sales suck and they can't get them off the showroom then the prices will be more lenient. Also if you wait to long then the 2015 model are sure to be higher, when has MSRP ever dropped the next year.

Oh…My mistake. I meant that Yamaha may be giving the bikes to the Dealerships at that price ($7590.50). And you hit the mark about the “new” factor. Very True. I’m just wondering how many Dealers would sell the bike for a cash amount that would cover MSRP, plus TTL (per locality of course) and $50 only (I threw in the $50 just because it “feels” right to do. No other reason. Just my gut instincts.) I think some on the site have stated that they have a deal like this. I’m hoping to get that kind of a deal myself, or at least very close to it.

 

[deadduck357]

Oh…My mistake. I meant that Yamaha may be giving the bikes to the Dealerships at that price ($7590.50). And you hit the mark about the “new” factor. Very True. I’m just wondering how many Dealers would sell the bike for a cash amount that would cover MSRP, plus TTL (per locality of course) and $50 only (I threw in the $50 just because it “feels” right to do. No other reason. Just my gut instincts.) I think some on the site have stated that they have a deal like this. I’m hoping to get that kind of a deal myself, or at least very close to it.

Oh, I see, I could have read it wrong myself. Wow that wouldnt give them much wiggle room. They gotta make a buck.

 

[chris1261]

I doubt the dealers are paying that much. I think their discount is closer to 10%

When Husqvarna got bought by KTM's CEO, they were cutting $1000 off of their TR 650 terra and strada models, and they were MSRP'd at $7000 and $7500 respectively. I got my Strada for $6300 otd, no dealer would lose money on inventory they already had if there was a choice.

I'm sure Yamaha is selling these to dealers at $7k or less

 

[NickJ]

I don't imagine that the dealers are paying much less than the MSRP on the bikes. I am not saying that they are loosing money, but I imagine that they are not going to be running to the bank after they sell through their FZ09 stock. The markup on bikes is not very high. If that were the case, then most motorcycle dealerships would not carry much in the way of accessories, because why would they? Why carry stock that you don't need to?

A majority of moto dealerships have so much inventory in accessories, that it is sometimes shameful. The real money is made in parts and service. There is a retail markup paradigm called a "Keystone." Keystone markup is a code word for a retailer to mark up the product 100%. Meaning that they bought it for $10, and sell it for $20. That is why most retailers are all too happy to sell last year's gear at a 50% discount. They replace their investment, and free up capitol for this year's piece.(Keystones are often used in "soft goods" like t-shirts, key-rings, coffee mugs; and not the "hard goods" like helmets, and jackets)

Watch your dealership's sale rack, and that will give you a window into their markup on gear:

• Several sizes of a jacket that just went to the sale rack? Probably about a 25% markdown on their markup. This nets the dealership a 25% profit.
• One or two odd sizes? Probably right at the break even point. Netting dealership 0% profit.
• One left that is a XXXXL and in an awful colorway? Well below their cost because they are tired of looking at it. Netting negative profit, but the buyer's mistake is now gone.

Retailers thrive when they make their stores look new and updated. That is one thing that I will give to the big corporate stores, gear based, or otherwise. When they get the new stuff in, there is an obvious change! Almost everything is rotated. Nothing is in the same place that it was in last week. Maybe the same section, but not the same place. Now you have to look for the thing that you almost bought last week. Maybe you find something new that you didn't see last week. It gives the buyer a sense of urgency.

Anyway, now that I am done with being off topic:
Moto dealerships don't make the money on the bike, they make it on the jacket and helmet you buy with the bike, as well as the setup charge they add to the cost of the bike. And then the service they perform on your bike once you already bought the bike.

 

[chris1261]

I would be very surprised if the dealers were making less than 10% markup on a bike. Probably closer to 20% if they sell it at msrp. it doesn't make sense to have a big ticket item making slim margins. the dealer could buy an index mutual fund and make 3.5% without having to get out of bed in the morning.

The bikes aren't there to draw in the jacket and helmet crowd. they are there to make a profit. the gear is just gravy, and mostly an impulse buy, because you can get it cheaper from the 'net.

I agree they make good money in service. parts markup is huge - 100% to 200%, and the markup on labor is tremendous too.

If it makes you feel better to think that the dealer's not getting rich off your purchase, then that's fine. I doubt it's true though.

after the FZ-09 has been out for a while, see what the spread is on cycle trader. even popular bikes are heavily discounted there. why would someone want to sell a bike at no profit? these are dealers too, not just guys going through a divorce.

 

[triplethreat]

When I sold new Hondas at a dealership back in the 2004, 2005, 2006 time frame, the difference between invoice and MSRP on a CBR 600RR and a CBR 1000RR was right at $1500 dollars. I was able to buy my 1000RR at Invoice pricing since I worked in their sales dept.

 

[NickJ]

What was sticker?

 

[N2faster]

Just for perspective, consider that a used Ferrari 430 sells for more than a brand new one. Why, there is about a 15 month wait to get a new one!

I sell industrial testing equipment and our commission is in the 8-15% range depending on the product. Since the FZ-09 is a price sensitive product it will be closer to the 8% mark-up figure. This is a product designed to spark excitement and get people in the door. Once the dealers get people in the door the upselling begins. "The FZ-09 is a wonderful bike but this R1 really has the performance that you are looking for." "Oh, you want to take your wife on day rides?" ... A full-figured touring bike may be closer to the 15% end of the mark-up range because there are more accessories involved.

I'm not hearing tremendous excitement from the dealers. Yes, it's a wonderful new bike but the profit margins just are not there. The price is very reasonable. We all like to feel like we got a good deal but why stress over getting a few bucks knocked off of the MSRP? For this initial run of FZ-09's if you will not pay the price someone else will... Pay the price and ride away happy.

 

[triplethreat]

What was sticker?

MSRP = $10,999
Invoice = Approx. $9400

 

[NickJ]

MSRP = $10,999
Invoice = Approx. $9400

The mark up for your dealership was 17% on that bike. Not exactly a mint. And that was on the Flagship bike... Just saying.

 

[triplethreat]

That's why I'm saying that there is absolutely NO reason a dealer cannot sell at MSRP and skip the F.&S........and still make a decent profit. Almost every Honda that we sold was just a few hundred bucks over invoice plus F.&S., which was on average around $250 to $300. We outsold every single Honda dealer in the ST. Louis, MO region and consequently accumulated a very large customer base for service, parts, accessories, etc.

 

[Cbass]

Back in the late '90s with the proliferation of the interwebs people started to research dealer invoices. They would show up to auto dealerships armed with printouts showing exactly what a dealer paid with "X" options package, etc... and offer only slightly above that. It made life very difficult for car salesmen (ask me how I know) and consequently the dealerships and factories came up with a "end of year bonus" arrangement whereby the factory paid a bonus to dealerships based on sales numbers and other criteria. It's just a way for the dealerships to make us think we're getting a good deal by paying only "x" amount over invoice when in reality that invoice number is not at all an accurate indicator of dealer cost. Pretty sneaky, eh?