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Pulsing front brakes

23K views 81 replies 26 participants last post by  MT09 2014 Sweden 
#1 ·
Hey all,

i asked this question earlier as part of my introduction post, but i figured i'd make an actual post in this section to have a more on topic conversation.

I purchased my '17 FZ 09 this weekend, and everything was awesome on my ride home (about 200kms). Last night i went out for a short ride and started to feel the front brakes pulsing when coming to a stop as if the rotors were warped. Same feeling as a warped mountain bike rotor if anyone knows how that feels?

Some members said to check the bobbins on the rotor, though im unsure what im looking for. Should there be any movement/play in the rotors/bobbins? they all felt 100% tight with no movement at all when i checked them this morning before heading out for work. (i compared them to my ER6N and they felt the same)

It would seem odd for the rotor to be warped if they felt perfectly fine on the ride long ride home. I don't have a stand to prop up the front wheel to spin and check for true-ness, so unsure of any other ideas there.

My next idea is to take off the caliper and clean/scuff up the pads and rotors and see if that changes anything.

Any other info would be great! thanks!
 
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#3 ·
its causing the whole bike to pulse forward and backwards as i come to a stop, as if the brake is grabbing harder and softer. It happens when i use front only so i know it must be the front. I assume soft-medium braking coming to a stop shouldnt be engaging the ABS? never felt this on my ER6N ABS
 
#6 ·
Could be a warped rotor but also could be some glazing on the rotors (my sons 701 suffered the same problem). It is possible the previous owner has used something to clean the bike that has affected the rotor surface. I would definitely give the rotors a clean with brake clean and steelo before spending any money. Also check the front wheel is properly mounted. loosen the front axle bolts including the pinch bolts, then tighten the main axle bolt, then the left side pinch bolt, then very slightly tighten the right side and bounce the front suspension a bit to force the right side fork to take its correct position, then tighten the right side pinch bolt.

You could also pull the pads and give them a gentle rough up as well with 120 grit on a flat surface. You should also re-bed the pads in with some hard braking between 140-30 kmh (that is, don't actually stop).

Note, a problem with checking for warped rotors is that you could find them slightly warped and might be tempted to replace them when the slight warp was not the issue.
 
#8 ·
If it was ABS kicking in on you I think you'd know it as it would be a pretty harsh pulsing (at least it is in the cars I've been in with malfunctioning ABS sensors).

My guess is rotor/pad surface. How many miles are on the bike/rotors/pads? I'm thinking they just aren't fully bedded yet.
 
#9 ·
Yeah, I’m fairly confident it’s not abs. The bike has 8300kms and to my knowledge the PO didn’t replace the pads and rotors. I’ll do a full brake clean/scuff up the rotors and pads and see how that goes.

Are the buttons/bobbins meant to have any movement in them?
 
#14 ·
A little late to the party, but ive been having the same issues with my 2019 MT 09 just after 2200 miles. I took it into a registered dealership and long story short, yamaha is sending new brake rotors. Their explanation was that the material on the rotors are of a material that can become uneven causing the pulsation.
 
#19 ·
...and long story short, yamaha is sending new brake rotors. Their explanation was that the material on the rotors are of a material that can become uneven causing the pulsation.
In continuation, I have used my fronts more and def have noticed pulsing at certain amounts of front brake application. So I may have the same problem as OP and thesmarte97.

Now, to approach the stealership...
 
#15 ·
thesmarte97 can you provide more detail into your issue? I'm experiencing some pulsation as well. I have a 2018 MT-09 purchased in 2019 w/ zero miles. I'm at the 5k mark and I'm I'm getting some pulsating only when using the front brakes. I just started noticing it as I don't use the front brakes that much... I rely on the rear brake for most of my riding. Only use front when extra braking is needed.

My next rides, I'll be using the fronts to test out WTF is going on.

If you can provide some deets on your experience with your stealership, I'll be able to use the same terminology to trigger a replacement if needed.

Kind regards, brah!
 
#17 ·
I just started noticing it as I don't use the front brakes that much... I rely on the rear brake for most of my riding. Only use front when extra braking is needed. Quote]

This is the way to a big accident. By using the rear brake all the time you will be habituated to using it and your first response in a real high risk situation will be to hit the rear brake. You'll either lock up and skid into whatever is ahead, or loop it.
I'd suggest an advanced riding course.
 
#16 ·
I would think it is your rotors that are warped if it were me, I would start with getting the front end off the ground.

Then I would spin the front wheel with out the applying pressure to lever.

If warped they may touch with out any pressure applied to lever or hot spots like mentioned.

If they have a no drag then apply some pressure to recreate the same symptom.

It's a 2 person job or a 1 person plus treadmill .

I'm sure you get yhe point, I don't have ac front stand yet my self but will soon for situation like yours .

I use my front brakes alot and so far I have no complaints on my brakes they have been very faithful to me.
 
#20 ·
I just bought my FZ09 with 9,000 miles on it and noticed the slight pulsing only after I bought it. It is most noticeable when coming to a slow stop at a stop sign. The same thing happened on my '02 FZ1 and I chased the problem with new pads and then scouring the disks. In the end it needed new rotors and that's what I did straightaway this time. Put new stock rotors and pads ($300) on yesterday and the problem is solved.

There are a lot of us with the 2017-19 model that are experiencing the same issue and I'm concerned that the stock disk material is insufficient for the demands of normal use. Does anyone know if the 2014-16 disks are the same part number as the 2017-19 model?
 
#22 ·
@thesmarte97 Thanks for the update. As I feared... the stealership didn't bother to really check my bike. They just did some brake tuning ( got it stiffer and claim to have lubed it ) but did not fix the pulsating. They never called me to notify they didn't find a problem and never called me to say they were performing a service I didn't ask for. Got charged for it of course. Now I'm trying to get the bike checked by them with me present.
 
#24 ·
@Moto26 Great analogy. I'll use it in the future. Yes this is what I have already taught myself.

The jerking I feel when braking is definitely there. Took it to the stealership again and had the mech ride it while I was there. He did confirm he feels it too. Thing is, he says the disks are within tolerance. The only thing he did was "re-surface" the brake pads and says it's mostly gone. "You have to really go looking for it to feel it now."

So what I read here is he did NOT fix the problem. I expect that with a few miles of breaking in the re-surfaced pads and... I think I'm going to have to call Yamaha directly to get this sorted out.

I haven't picked up the bike yet from stealership, so have not ridden it. I'll report as soon as...
 
#25 ·
By "the disc's are within tolerance" do you mean thickness or runout? Because the pulsing can only be caused by excess runout, or a problem with part of the disc material. Just confirm, is the pulsing in the brake lever too?
Sanding the pads may only have disguised the problem.
 
#26 ·
So, just got back from stealership. I'm going to quote what it says on the "Repair Order":

"Measured both rotors runout. Near perfect less than 0.001 of an inch. Spec limit is 0.004 inch. Removed brake pads and cleaned up with wire wheel, emory cloth and spray brake cleaner. cleaned both rotors. road tested. Condition diminished considerably but faintly still there. Personaly would not do anything further because when brakes used properly not noticable only if you go looking for it. Otherwise the next step would to replace brake pads and maybe perform front brake slush and bleed. Looks dark."

The typos are not mine. They are from the mech that did the service.

Ok, so I rode the bike... PROBLEM IS STILL THERE with the same intensity. NO CHANGE what so ever. Ok, so he recommends replacing the brake pads... My bike only has 6k miles, and I've been feeling this, well, now that I have experience with the bike, since zero miles. Ok, why did I not report it immediately and get it sorted? I had not ridden a motorcycle for over 6 years. I just got this one... and I thought the "brake issues" I was having was due to my fear and inexperience. Now that I'm confident with the bike, I know what to look for. I've also ridden other friends bikes now and no pulsating on their bikes. So I know now it's not me or something I'm doing wrong. Back to the pads... So every 6k miles I have to replace my pads? I don't buy this. Ok, so if I replace the pads and the problem is still there??? What then?

So on Monday I'm going to call Yamaha Motorsports Customer Relations.

I've seen recommendations online to change the brake pads ASAP cause the OEMs are crap ( @TwoWheelObsession (y)) and I am willing to do this. But if I do it on my own, what will Yamaha say??? What will the dealer say??? Oh you ****ed up... we are not covering this. So I pay the price of having the stealership replace them for me... and what if the problem is still there??? I will have paid for what??? Will they give me all my money back?

I'll keep ya'll posted. Just sucks that no one else, except one person, is having the same "ghost" issue. FUDGE!!!

Keep two wheels down boys!
 
#67 ·
So, just got back from stealership. I'm going to quote what it says on the "Repair Order": "Measured both rotors runout. Near perfect less than 0.001 of an inch. Spec limit is 0.004 inch. Removed brake pads and cleaned up with wire wheel, emory cloth and spray brake cleaner. cleaned both rotors. road tested. Condition diminished considerably but faintly still there. Personaly would not do anything further because when brakes used properly not noticable only if you go looking for it. Otherwise the next step would to replace brake pads and maybe perform front brake slush and bleed. Looks dark." The typos are not mine. They are from the mech that did the service. Ok, so I rode the bike... PROBLEM IS STILL THERE with the same intensity. NO CHANGE what so ever. Ok, so he recommends replacing the brake pads... My bike only has 6k miles, and I've been feeling this, well, now that I have experience with the bike, since zero miles. Ok, why did I not report it immediately and get it sorted? I had not ridden a motorcycle for over 6 years. I just got this one... and I thought the "brake issues" I was having was due to my fear and inexperience. Now that I'm confident with the bike, I know what to look for. I've also ridden other friends bikes now and no pulsating on their bikes. So I know now it's not me or something I'm doing wrong. Back to the pads... So every 6k miles I have to replace my pads? I don't buy this. Ok, so if I replace the pads and the problem is still there??? What then? So on Monday I'm going to call Yamaha Motorsports Customer Relations. I've seen recommendations online to change the brake pads ASAP cause the OEMs are crap ( @TwoWheelObsession (y)) and I am willing to do this. But if I do it on my own, what will Yamaha say??? What will the dealer say??? Oh you ****ed up... we are not covering this. So I pay the price of having the stealership replace them for me... and what if the problem is still there??? I will have paid for what??? Will they give me all my money back? I'll keep ya'll posted. Just sucks that no one else, except one person, is having the same "ghost" issue. FUDGE!!! Keep two wheels down boys!
Its your head bearing. There is some play and your bearings need to be tightened down or head bearings need to be replaced. When you press on your front brake there is a downward force of pressure which will slightly twitch your head bearing which causes the pulsating feel on your brakes.
 
#28 ·
I'm looking into ordering them online today. But will def call Yamaha tomorrow. No big deal having new pads as spares if Yamaha gives me some other solution ( doubt it ), but at least I'll have them on the way anyway.
 
#29 ·
So, per the stealership mech, I've replaced the brake pads with some EBC pads per @TwoWheelObsession 's recomendation. :) and done a front brake flush.

Guess what... the problem is still the same as always. So back to the stealership soon for more BS FUN!
 
#30 ·
Do you have any buddies with your same bike you could swap front wheels with for an afternoon/couple of hours? Idk that i'd trust the runout results just b/c I'm not sure how dummy proof that is. Still sounds like warped rotor to me. Otherwise, maybe try to level w/ the dealer and ask if they have a floor bike they could swap rotors on for testing just to humor you?
 
#33 ·
So I went to my local dealer. The response I got...

So I told the mechanic that I replaced the brake pads and did a brake fluid flush as per his recommendations... and he said, "Well, the reason I recommended those is that so that I would do them..." ... "...so that I could see if there was something wrong."

I said, "Well, I can show you the old brake pads...".

He said, "No, it's so that I could see if there was anything wrong."

I said, "Well, the last time you removed the old brake pads, you would have seen the same thing, uneven wear on the pads. You didn't see that the last time? You said you resurfaced them!"

So he says, "I will be unable to resolve your concerns."

... Erm... ???
 
#36 ·
So I went to my local dealer. The response I got...

So I told the mechanic that I replaced the brake pads and did a brake fluid flush as per his recommendations... and he said, "Well, the reason I recommended those is that so that I would do them..." ... "...so that I could see if there was something wrong."

I said, "Well, I can show you the old brake pads...".

He said, "No, it's so that I could see if there was anything wrong."

I said, "Well, the last time you removed the old brake pads, you would have seen the same thing, uneven wear on the pads. You didn't see that the last time? You said you resurfaced them!"

So he says, "I will be unable to resolve your concerns."

... Erm... ???
I wouldn't go back. The reason being that he wants to throw parts at the bike in the hope of fixing it. Real Techs find the problem, then replace only the parts that are needed.
 
#35 ·
Hopefully the dealer has lost your business at this point, and you can find a different, more trust worthy place that will try to "earn" your business by treating you right.
 
#39 ·
You can bet your rear, they will never see a penny off my pocket.

That's why I do my own servicing.
Just got my set of Pit-Bull stands this week. About to go put them to good use right now. Yep, I'm going to be doing ALL my own service. Great fun learning and having a few beers on a rainy weekend. Fudge Yeah!
 
#42 ·
Hi Guys, I'm a transplant from the FJ-09.org site. Been a member here for a long time cause I originally bought a FZ-09 in Jan. 2014. Regarding the pulsating front brakes. I have had this since purchase of my FJ-09. Originally it was so faint that it didn't bother me. It got worse as time and mile added up. I now have 90K and it drives me crazy. Originally the dealer had no knowledge of what it could be other than the obvious, and I knew it wasn't that, so I lived with it. No problem at speed, only at slow speeds, like in stopping. I have learned to use my rear brake to complete all stops or during congestion, stop and go. I can almost eliminate the problem by changing the brake fluid, but it comes back in 1-1.5K, and I have done this multiple times. At 30K I decided to wear out the front disks, 100K+ and then replace them and see what happens. If it is the same, it wouldn't be a waste of money. I hate wasting money.
 
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