Yamaha FZ-09 Forum banner

1 - 20 of 52 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey Guys, new member. Bought the FZ-09 a few months ago and have loved it for the most part. I come from sportbikes, so the suspension feels a little sub par which is to be expected for the price, but the motor, WOW! What a gem. They need to put this sucker in an R6 chassis.

Well up until last Sunday I had just been zipping around Nashville for work and such, but I finally got a chance to suit up in the leather and go for a real ride on my second home, Deal's Gap aka The Dragon/US 129. I hate to say it, but it pretty much sucked. I nearly turned around and went home after the first few turns. Not because of the tourist, or cops, or Harley's/Squids/Drifters/Weather/etc. All of that was actually pretty darn good for summer weekend. It was a perfect Sunday for a ride at the Gap, but the stupid throttle response of the FZ just about ruined it.

I have already ordered the reflash from Stoltec, just need to take the time to park the bike and send in ECU, so hopefully that fixes everything. But otherwise, I would probably put a for sale sign on it. It is inconceivable that Yamaha would let the bike go on the market like this. Combined with the bouncy suspension, this thing is a nightmare at a tight road like the Gap. You can't trailbrake, you can't roll on the throttle with any kind of trust... I was literally white knuckles the whole time.

I was eventually able to somewhat ride around the problem by seriously limiting my riding style/lines, and staying in 3rd gear the whole time, even though 1st and 2nd would have been much more appropriate. In the lower gears, the off idle response was just way too harsh, so tiny throttle inputs were the only way to carry any kind of pace through the curves. I was eventually able to run at a "quick' pace by most standards and get a knee down consistently, but it was nowhere near what I could do on my old ninja.

I will not go back until I get at least the ecu flashed, and I recommend to the rest of you planning trips to the Dragon to do the same before you waste you time and money. I have a house in Knoxville so it's not a big deal for me, other's plan their whole year around it and that would be such a shame. Speaking of, I did a see a red FZ09 up there on Sunday. Anyone here?

Regardless of how she rode, I gotta admit the bike still looked pretty damn good up there...:D



Does the tiny tail section make my ass look fat? Or is it just my fat ass... Bike looks so much better after chopping the fender and taillight.


I'll post up a ride report (hopefully w/ video) of my next ride up there post ecu reflash. Hope to have a lot more good stuff to say by then.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
3,470 Posts
Great post! Sucks about your ride and disappointment. Get that ECU in the mail ASAP so you can Really enjoy Your FZ. Assume about a week R/T, but some have reported quicker turnarounds :cool:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
It is inconceivable that Yamaha would let the bike go on the market like this. .
you can thank the USA for that, not yamaha. same story on all bikes sold in the US, emissions regulations force manufacturers to do things that kill performance of it. hence, flash is the way to go on all bikes, stock or modified.

also fyi, stoltec is deferring all flashing to his R&D business partner, 2 wheel dynoworks
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,734 Posts
That might have been me up there on the Red FZ09! Was there a Red FZ07 with it? My wife and I were up there last Sunday. I made a short run up from the store and back, then her and I left to head back to the house. I rode mine several times up there before I did the reflash and it's tight enough there that I mostly rode in the STD mode instead of the A mode. I didn't have a lot of trouble with the throttle, but I approached it just the opposite of what you did. I kept it mostly in 1st and a little in second (downshifting to first before I started turn in for a corner), that way, when you roll off the throttle for corner entrance and braking, the engine RPM doesn't drop down enough to cut fueling .....somewhere around 4300 RPM.
 
  • Like
Reactions: emtechbali

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,734 Posts
also fyi, stoltec is deferring all flashing to his R&D business partner, 2 wheel dynoworks
Thanks for posting that Jared......I forgot to put that in my post!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I feel like we must have met sometime over the last few years, in addition to the Gap, I used to ride with STT pretty often, back in like 08-10 when I did track days. Lot of fun, miss those days. What bike(s) did you ride? I was usually on a ninja, zx6 or zx10.

I tried the 1st gear thing, but it doesn't allow me to ride like I usually ride up there. Even winding out first, I still go off throttle while braking/leaning into the turn and then roll on from 0% around the apex. That's also the time I'm pretty much mostly leaned all the way over. Every time I would try to gradually roll on and power as I went through and out of turn,there would be this lag where there would be zero power until I opened the throttle more and more, and then bam, all of a sudden a lurch when you don't expect it. Had the peg feelers catch a few times and scare the crap out of me (took them off since=recommended). Maybe it is accentuated by my style, but I've put in a BUNCH of miles up there, comfortably at a much higher pace, and it took everything I had to keep it out of a ditch last weekend a few time. With the current throttle response, it simply isn't possible for me to go anywhere near the limits of myself or what would otherwise be the limits of the bike. Not that I am saying that is the goal or a good idea on a public road...:)

So what do you guys think about the stock tires? Specifically what PSI do you run for "aggressive" summer riding? Not thrilled with them so far, but it may be more about the suspension and pressures I was running.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
601 Posts
After two hours on the bike, I knew that I wouldn't go near Deal's Gap without sorting the fuel and suspension. I had the bike parked for the most part until I had that fixed.

Still you look like you were shuffling around pretty darn good despite the stock jerky, bronco ride.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,155 Posts
you can thank the USA for that, not yamaha. same story on all bikes sold in the US, emissions regulations force manufacturers to do things that kill performance of it. hence, flash is the way to go on all bikes, stock or modified.
The EPA does force all the manufacturers to set up fueling on the lean side....but It's Yamahas FZ-09 Fuel cut off and the ride by wire that is at fault here. It's just shameful to sell a bike like that. My Yamaha FZ6 was jerky too in the corners too and was barely rideable for knee dragging. In Yamaha's defense they did manage to get the FZ-07 right. How that happened I don't know, but mine is the smoothest fuel injected bike I ever owned.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,476 Posts
The EPA does force all the manufacturers to set up fueling on the lean side....but It's Yamahas FZ-09 Fuel cut off and the ride by wire that is at fault here. It's just shameful to sell a bike like that. My Yamaha FZ6 was jerky too in the corners too and was barely rideable for knee dragging. In Yamaha's defense they did manage to get the FZ-07 right. How that happened I don't know, but mine is the smoothest fuel injected bike I ever owned.
Your bike is not throttle by wire and is missing quite a few HP so its not really comparable to the 09...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Davinci

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,734 Posts
I feel like we must have met sometime over the last few years, in addition to the Gap, I used to ride with STT pretty often, back in like 08-10 when I did track days. Lot of fun, miss those days. What bike(s) did you ride? I was usually on a ninja, zx6 or zx10.

I tried the 1st gear thing, but it doesn't allow me to ride like I usually ride up there. Even winding out first, I still go off throttle while braking/leaning into the turn and then roll on from 0% around the apex. That's also the time I'm pretty much mostly leaned all the way over. Every time I would try to gradually roll on and power as I went through and out of turn,there would be this lag where there would be zero power until I opened the throttle more and more, and then bam, all of a sudden a lurch when you don't expect it. Had the peg feelers catch a few times and scare the crap out of me (took them off since=recommended). Maybe it is accentuated by my style, but I've put in a BUNCH of miles up there, comfortably at a much higher pace, and it took everything I had to keep it out of a ditch last weekend a few time. With the current throttle response, it simply isn't possible for me to go anywhere near the limits of myself or what would otherwise be the limits of the bike. Not that I am saying that is the goal or a good idea on a public road...:)

So what do you guys think about the stock tires? Specifically what PSI do you run for "aggressive" summer riding? Not thrilled with them so far, but it may be more about the suspension and pressures I was running.
Now that you mention it, I've seen the name FLOJOE......either on the STT forum or maybe on ETR....which I'm a member of (xrated, over there). I don't know if we've ever met or not, but I too feel like I know you....somehow, someway. Get the ECU reflashed and most of your throttling issues will be over. It is possibly to ride the hill without it, but incredibly smooth is the key...and riding in STD mode doesn't hurt either. Nice to see you on the FZ09 forum man.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
385 Posts
Wow, bummed out to hear this. You look like you know what the hell you are talking about, so I can't call you out there. I did have my suspension done by Traxxion (AK 20s and Penske in rear) and in the north GA mountains (wolf pen gap, blood mountain, 60 loop) I have been having a blast. More fun then my Tuono. I have the stock map and I actually like the engine braking (leave it in 2nd or 3rd and just twist on/off). Every stop is wheelie practice. I have been leaving it in STD as it is plenty o power and not jerky.

I know Deals Gap there are a lot more hairpins, but wolf pen gap is similar. With this bike you can't get a lot of weight on the front so you gotta just hang the ham and let it go.

Anyway, bummed to hear this from an experienced rider, but I am still having a blast on this 8K bike that you can beat the hell out of, throw against the garage wall when you are done and do it all over again on the weekends.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,155 Posts
Your bike is not throttle by wire and is missing quite a few HP so its not really comparable to the 09...
Horsepower is useless if you can't put it the ground in the corners. If you read FLOJOE's post...that is what he was trying to say. If you want a comparison....FLOJOE on a FZ-07 would be quicker through the Gap than he was on the FZ-09 ....by quite a bit.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
64 Posts
Maybe you have a sync issue with your throttle bodies. If you arent having legitimate technical issues, it just comes off sounding like just another driver blaming the car for a loss. Only in this case, rider and bike. You have to ride the bike, not manhandle the bike. You have to move with the bike, roll the throttle the way the chassis/engine wants it rolled. Its like an old wife, you can try to make her do things all you want but its not gonna happen until she wants to do it. Every car/bike/moped/boat ive ever ridden driven or raced, I treat 100% different from eachother. A common mistake I told my team mates, is that when you get into the car or on the bike, you naturally and instantly compare it to every other one youve been in/on. If you want to ride it at its maximum, you can't do that because each chassis transfers its energy differently and to compare them in your head, confuses your body. The subtle body twitches that worked on one chassis, won't on another. You gotta feel it out and listen to the bike instead of forcing it to be what you think it should. Once youve heard what the bike is telling you, then you can truly start modding it to improve.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Yeah, xrated, I knew I recognized the avatar. Not sure if we ever met in person and actually realized it, but we have talked over the forum some. I used to race mini's at the gap, so you may recognize me from that. i was the one with the Hopkins Monster helmet that crashed a lot. LOL. Small world when it comes to this stuff I guess, good to see you over here as well. I still have a house in Knoxville I rent out most of the time, but I've been working out of town the last few years and I don't get back there much these days, so I haven't been really active on etr lately. Still check it out every now and then though. Seems like everyone went to facebook so it doesn't get used as often, which sucks cuz I'm not a facebook guy.

I actually only ride in STD mode, even regular rides on the street. The power difference of A is noticeable, but it makes the jerkiness even worse so it's not worth it. You can't even pop a good wheelie without worrying about it looping you off. After slamming my nuts on the tank a few times after I first got it, it has pretty much been all STD mode from then on. Can't wait to be able to feel the full potential of that motor all the time though.

Looks like I'm yanking that ECU this weekend and sending it off. So if I already paid Stoltec, do I still send it to the other guy?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I don't know about a sync issue, maybe. I hear what you are saying about driver/rider blaming the machine, but I really don't think this is the case. I've ridden/driven several vehicles up there, literally thousands of miles on the Dragon alone. Owned all of these bikes (and then some) and ridden them up there over the years comfortably without ever once saying I felt like I could have gone faster if it wasn't for the bike.






Maybe my bike is worse than normal for some reason. But as someone with a pretty good amount of experience on several different bikes, I'm comfortable saying this one is a weirdo. Regardless of emissions, if this is how Yamaha intended it to hit the street, it is a major screw-up on what was otherwise an engineering home run. I am really thinking it has more to do with the drive-by-wire. I had a 2002.5 VW GTI VR6 that has drive-by-wire (first year they introduced it). Had all kinds of similar lag issues, well documented on the forums back then as well.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
5,734 Posts
FLOJOE........you've got a PM from me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,424 Posts
FloJoe, Nashville here, and I would have never attempted US129 on the stock bike. It is down right dangerous for anyone over 120 lbs in stock trim on the dragon. My throttle is completely sorted out with flash, pcv, and G2 Throttle tamer (Y200 profile). Suspension took 10W fluid and stiffer springs, and a Penske shock in the rear.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
418 Posts
I'm always disappointed when I go to Deals Gap no matter what bike I ride! I've been there 16 times in the past 3 years because a lot of people I ride with want to go and have this concept of it being the mecca of motorcycle roads. Online hype and marketing have given people a false idea about that place. Highway 28 starting in Walhalla is where it's at! 1,000x better than The Dragon could ever be. Hit the Skyway for even more fun. On the last trip there 2 of the riders in my group got speeding tickets on The Dragon. One guy for going 34 and the other going 37. Total BS! The cops there are just like Girl Scouts and a fund raiser, but giving you a speeding ticket instead of a box of cookies. The past 2 times I went I rode with the group to Deals Gap, but just ate lunch, mingles with other riders, and waited for the group to return at the restaurant.
 
  • Like
Reactions: buck

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
FloJoe, Nashville here, and I would have never attempted US129 on the stock bike. It is down right dangerous for anyone over 120 lbs in stock trim on the dragon. My throttle is completely sorted out with flash, pcv, and G2 Throttle tamer (Y200 profile). Suspension took 10W fluid and stiffer springs, and a Penske shock in the rear.
Well I'm definitely not close to 120 lbs, even in my fitter years. Suspension is on the list assuming the ecu fixes the throttle issues. Just wasn't sure how far I wanted to go with it. The bike has great potential, can't wait to see what it can do. Which Penske you go with? I was thinking the double clicker.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
657 Posts
On the Dragon, I ran in B-mode. A and STD were too snatchy at roll-on out of the corner. It would upset the chassis and the sub-par stock suspension didn't help things. B was very manageable. The flash will give B mode like roll-on smoothness in A mode.

I totally agree that out of the box this is not a great knee-dragging bike. It is however an excellent starting platform at a great price-point. I didn't originally purchase this bike as a knee-draggin machine, but when I want it to perform like a SuperSport, it's going to require:

ECU re-flash so smoothen out throttle (check)
Front Forks valving and proper springs (check)
Rear shock upgrade (yet to do)
Adj rearsets (yet to do) - too low for aggressive lean angles.

With those above items sorted, it'll be a very capable bike for spirited riding.
 
1 - 20 of 52 Posts
Top