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Dobek EJK for a 2017 or Power commander?

This is a discussion on Dobek EJK for a 2017 or Power commander? within the FZ-09 Performance & Suspension forums, part of the Yamaha FZ-09 Garage category; Flash: The preset is in; so a mail back for each tune. Dobeck: A tuneable product by a touch of a button. PCV: Must run ...

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Thread: Dobek EJK for a 2017 or Power commander?

  1. #11
    Senior Member Catch22's Avatar
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    Flash: The preset is in; so a mail back for each tune.
    Dobeck: A tuneable product by a touch of a button.
    PCV: Must run a daisy-chain from one accessory to another we think autotune.

    Flash: More or less stuck with a preset as if buying a new ECU that came with the preset. Mail and wait.
    Dobeck: Just a click away if the weather changes to suit the ambient.
    PCV: You'd have to run a new autotune and save to run in this changing ambient from season to season.

    Flash: The preset is set the day it was flashed, meaning room pressure was 29 and change in air pressure.
    Dobeck: Load based is real time setting so you have the X to Y programmed for any air change.
    PCV: Start autotune for the day and oh btw, a mid-afternoon map is not going to run well when the weather changes [if saved].

    Flash: Again, you are stuck with a parameter as if the stock ECU runs in a parameter, it's a non-moving-set-preset.
    Dobeck: This unit is in the cheap seats as a tuning tool. It layers a rich setting over the OE setting, as if moving the water spigot open a bit more.
    PCV: This unit takes time to retune itself after you install the X factor into the cells. Where can you sustain rpm so it can tune that Y parameter? Then the next 250 rpm increment and so on. A dyno is where you make a map.

    Flash: Have to mail it back to return to stock.
    Dobeck: Unplug and sell. Can't sell a flash.
    PCV: Unplug the Big Bucks adding the autotune parts. Recoup some cash reselling.

    Flash: Sets the torque curve lower and is preset.
    Dobeck: Can set the curve anywhere.
    PCV: Can set the curve anywhere.

    Flash: Runs at a certain AFR.
    Dobeck: Can only run rich with its settings.
    PCV: Can be programmed to run leaner.

    And are we open pipe, no restrictions and will be involved with racing the bike? Then a pig enhancement sure.
    Are the pipes for street and have a muffler type insert? And you putt most of the time? No pig needed.

  2. #12
    Supporting Vendor fuelmoto's Avatar
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    I have put together some additional information based on how a speed density ECU operates as well as how the tuning products operate respectively some may find helpful.

    A speed density ECU is based on modeled airflow, the ECU calculates air density using MAP (manifold pressure) X RPM X IAT (intake air temp). The ECU performs many thousands of calculation per second using this data along with various lookup tables (most importantly modeled airflow) to determine fuel delivery requirements and it is continually adjusting for relative conditions. This negates the requirements of fuel injected vehicles to be to retuned for different weather & conditions, essentially bikes in different altitudes & regions do not have different factory calibrations. For example a FZ09 in Florida at sea level is delivered by Yamaha with the same OE calibration as a bike in Denver at 10,000 ft. Changing components such as an exhaust system is another story, as the calibration was developed for a specific airflow model; change the exhaust you have changed the airflow model so it need to be retuned for best overall performance, other points to consider is the overall accuracy/quality of the stock tune in the first place (not a strong point for the FZ09), as well as the lean AF targets due to EPA regulations.

    A proper ECU flash will recalibrate the necessary fuel/timing tables for a given application, and on many bikes like the FZ09 there are excellent gains from adjusting the throttle blade tables and reconfiguring/removing various limits within the tune. This is the most powerful way to tune and is non invasive as you are simply retuning the factory hardware, the drawback is you have to send in or exchange your ECU, or take it to a dyno tuner that performance this service.

    If you choose you add a piggyback tuner like a Power Commander or Dobeck the ECU continues to do business as usual, and while they take different routes the end result between the two products is to make a final correction the injector signal downstream from the ECU. While I admittedly have limited knowledge of the Dobeck box it is a whats referred to as a pulse spreader, it is used to richen the mixture by simply modifying the injector pulse, the reference to load based tuning is used because it changes the pulsewidth based off what the ECU is already delivering, the ECU is load based; not the Dobeck. It does not use software rather buttons & modes on the device, no real way to pinpoint the exact area you want to adjust or exactly/accurately what you are adjusting. Power Commander operates differently; it uses a processor and has its own injector drivers to run the injectors. It is an alpha-N type tuner which means the fuel table is based on RPM X TPS, it uses software based fuel maps that can be configured by cylinder and by gear, which gives you thousands of tuning points which can be pinpointed right in the software. The Auto Tune accessory uses a Bosch wideband O2 which populates live tune corrections as you ride, it maintains the AF specified in the PC-V fuel map in real-time. You have control of the +/- % adjustments, runtime, and other parameters. The trims are stored in memory and can be applied back to the base map in the software. I hope this info is helpful and if anyone has any questions they are welcome to contact me.
    Last edited by fuelmoto; 06-15-2017 at 01:41 PM.
    LouG, CRFan1 and troop like this.
    Jamie Long - Fuel Moto USA
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  3. #13
    Junior Member Canuck12's Avatar
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    Fuel Moto thank you for that very informative post. I learned a lot, that is probably the best explanation of ECU flashing vs Piggback tuning I have read! I'm sure many reader will find it useful. I have decided that an ECU flash is definitely the way to go for myself and I will be taking this route.
    Thanks again!

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  5. #14
    Supporting Vendor fuelmoto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canuck12 View Post
    Fuel Moto thank you for that very informative post. I learned a lot, that is probably the best explanation of ECU flashing vs Piggback tuning I have read! I'm sure many reader will find it useful. I have decided that an ECU flash is definitely the way to go for myself and I will be taking this route.
    Thanks again!
    Glad to have helped. Also note we just purchased a 2017 FZ09 for further ECU flash and Power Commander development.
    marthy likes this.
    Jamie Long - Fuel Moto USA
    info@fuelmotousa.com
    www.fuelmotousa.com
    920-423-3309

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